Leonard Mlodinow – Is Consciousness Ultimate Reality?

40 thoughts on “Leonard Mlodinow – Is Consciousness Ultimate Reality?”

1. qualia inner feeling is always way of catagorising just like outer world material world

2. This was slightly annoying to listen to because of all the interruptions going on.

3. my boy BOBBY KUHN went “HAM” … 💀💀💀 … 🤭
   🐒💨

4. Ultimately, the question seems to be "if we can understand how every pattern in the brain arises to give you a particular feeling, then have we solved the issue of why we feel that way?" I personally like Leonard's answer, which I take as "I don't know until they have solved it" (although I think Leonard was implying that he doesn't think that fully solving the physical problem translates to solving the consciousness problem in 4:15. And then the conversation kinda went off course.)

   There seems to be merit in figuring out why living things have consciousness and water doesn't. In other words, what is fundamentally different about a structure that gives rise to consciousness? I think the solution to the original problem depends heavily on what it is that makes something conscious, which we haven't figured out yet. And until we figure it out, this conversation isn't going to get anywhere.

5. Robert is not suffering his foolishness today…😂😂

6. All we know is that we must communicate in absolute terms to be understood. Kant is the game changer.

7. We are all TV ❤

8. Consciousness is the Planck frequency of superfluid quantum space.

9. human brain / neurons have and aware of quantum waves with consciousness?

10. in contrast to water molecules making waves in ocean; time and energy make quantum waves inside neuron particles?

11. human brain aware of quantum consciousness / mind through time and energy?

12. consciousness might generate time and energy that develop quantum wave function / fields?

13. I agree with Leonard, you can’t simply speculate and then call it science.

14. I wonder if the heart has a role in feeling something? It certainly feels like there is a connection to the chest when you are heartbroken for example.

15. BASICaly he says u can have the answer for question of how but you will never know the answer of questions of what

16. Qualia is nothing more than language. No language no Qualia, only sensing. Counciousness is nothing special. Give a dog language and it will be self aware and have Qualia.

17. Robert was testing Leonard's gangsta

18. Awareness is known by awareness alone.

19. The very name of physics for whole knowledge is just incorrect.. before there humans used the word metaphysics witch integrates both worlds: non alive and alive.. what separates or actually connects both? Consciousness

20. roughing the philosopher

21. Just saying we need to learn more functional processes in the brain to understand a very real metaphysical issue is not enough. Just be honest with yourself: you are only studying correlations NOT how current physical allows consciousness to exist in the first place. Scientists (which I highly respect and value) get extremely uncomfortable when asked to explain consciousness. The question and evidence we rely on is so utterly absurd that it leads highly trained analytical philosophers to produce positions like Russellian Constitutional Panpsychism in an attempt to produce a non-dualist hypothesis for the mind-body problem trying to stay coherent with the dominant body of work that philosophically known as physicalism. Philosophers like David Chalmers are fundamentally materialists at heart confronting the hard problem of conscious experience. You can find all the correlations with the brain as you like, but why does consciousness experience happen in a reality we understand through current accepted views in general relativity and quantum mechanics? This is a FAR deeper problem than just studying the brain.

22. Right. Right. Right.

23. This discussion comes finally to the truth that Leonard Mlodinov doesn't know anything at all about the subject. 😏
    He is still agnostic about the true fact that full Artificial Consciousness can be created by a bad computer programmer in maximum one day with an ordinary laptop and a couple other minor gadgets.
    One day? 🤔
    Yes. I'm talking here about a bad computer programmer. 🙄😯

24. Robert was ready to scrap

25. An emotion is not something you can calculate … idiot.

26. Can’t they already elicit feelings by stimulating areas of the brain? If so, unsatisfyingly done. Qualia in my thinking is not the thing but rather our description or interpretation of senses experience.

27. It's pretty easy to explain all of this if you're an Idealist: mind is the fundamental ontology – that's what exists. What you measure in an experiment is still mental – it's how mind appears. When you see a brain you see the extrinsic appearance of a metacognitive mental entity. When you're measuring electrons or chair or whatever physical object, that's still made "of mind", it's just that it's not structured in a way that allows for meta-cognition to occur.

    So the brain doesn't cause consciousness, consciousness doesn't "emerge" out of brain activity. The brain and the brain activity is the image of a conscious process – it's how a conscious process looks like when investigated, when observed from a 2nd or 3rd person perspective. That image doesn't carry with it the contents of the mind, only correlations with those contents.

28. He doesn't know. Nobody knows.
    I'm so frustrated with it all!

29. Do what you can. But you cannot objectively study consciousness. Only thing about consciousness we know is that it interprets the signals from the material world reaching our brain and gives us a view of the world which has absolutely nothing to do with the real material world (I.e., a electromagnetic wave of a certain frequency has nothing to do with colour green.)

30. It likely would be a good thing if we make a map of things we know are there and also know we will likely never be able to explain it scientifically. I think we have a problem accepting that the world is way more complex than we pretend it is.

31. I want more of this brain food!

32. There IS no qualia. The brain is a pattern based machine. Uses patterns inside and looks for patterns outside. And the consciousness arises from the pattern recognition. But there IS no such thing as patterns. And herein lies the crux of the whole illusion. In the ACT of registering a pattern, requires something for it to be registered against. And patterns on patterspns later and you get the ILLUSION of awareness. You are really just a pattern detector.

33. Consciousness is like an auto correcting, autonomous network. Spontaneous molecular rearrangement, is an example… This can be measured. Most of the universe can be said to have some amount of proto consciousness. Energy tends towards the lowest possible state no matter what.

    But, as is pointed out, self aware consciousness, which is not the same thing, cannot be measured.

    Which means, the pathway can be mapped, yes, but nothing can be said about being the driver inside of a feeling "self." The other minds problem… This will always be yours alone.

    Possibly the root of existential thoughts, possibly what gives us self awareness in the first place. The constant dissonance between grasping meaning and understanding others, and the same can be said about reproducing and death. Legacy and power…

    Without long term rapor building with other self aware consciousnesses, how can we have a representation of our own "self?" Especially one based on a shared language?
    Dialectics, question answer dichotomy.
    (This reminds me of the video of two cheetahs being confused by the SPOT robot because it didn't have eyes to engage with… How can they be cheetahs, which evolved to read eyes, without that?)

    Early childhood development of language is fundamentally important to the outcome and expression of the "self."
    The social aspect is obviously a prerequisite, but are feelings and oxytocin driven… feel good events (hugs, and kisses), which came before language, enough to create a person who's "self" is actualized in a way as to share ideas in a complex modern society? Are they able to become more than just an auto correcting network? Can they become a true "self…"
    (My example for this thought is the girl who lived with dogs. Was she a human "self" when found? No. Did she have the ability to undo some of that with rigorous human exposure? Yes. Was there fundamental aspects of her psyche that where "damaged" relative to modern societal norms? Yes. Can we ever know what she went through…? Never, not even if she explained it better than anyone ever has. On the other hand, was it a lack of empathy driven, oxytocin events that caused these latter problems? Humans need both. You can't be a "self," without language and a super ego, and that language must be taught early to children, with care and compassion, to be useful…)

    Meaning, learning is fundamentally a willingness to update information, after becoming self aware and ego driven, what we generally call adulthood. Otherwise, it's just your imprinting…An auto correcting autonomous network.

    Learning in this manner, before becoming an adult, is a form of consciousness. It's just not self awareness yet. I think most people conflate consciousness with self awareness. Children are conscious well before they become self aware… The imprinting process is fundamental to that self awareness emerging.

    Our selves are impressions we build, for our selves, based on input imprinted on us by our nuclear family/societal setting/ genetic predisposition. We can only ever broadcast good ideas and conventions, through shared and constructed language associations, and answer questions. The rest has to happen before we can put meaning to it.

34. We have to pretend there is such a thing as 'objectivity', as it is generally very useful to do so – particularly in problem solving. At the same time we must never forget (looking at you – scientists) that there is no such thing as absolute 'objectivity' it is simply a construct.

35. IMPORTANT! Solution!: Counsciousness is NOT ultimate reality. It is just It is an EVENT, not an object. When two cars collide science can study the objects, the stuff, mass and energy included, BUT science can not study the collision itself since It is NOT a physical "being".
    Counsciousness is also an EVENT, that is simply why we said science can not achieve It. Science can study the stuff: neurons, chemicals and electricity BUT can not study the event called counsciousness.

36. Great interview, thanks.

37. At 6:20 Leonard Mlodinow – "… not until you tell me what qualia are."
    Perhaps the question might be better reframed not in terms of consciousness as ultimate reality, but in terms of the processes of consciousness. To this end, the semiotics of Charles Sanders Peirce, with particular emphasis on association. Association as fundamental. Consider Gestalt psychology, "the whole is more than the sum of the parts", with association providing the foundation for gestalt formation. Qualia as gestalt. Even the Feynman diagrams seem to suggest something of this associational Peircean dynamic. For example, a water molecule as a gestalt, as the association of oxygen & hydrogen atoms.
    Taking this route, it's not too much of a leap to conclude that yes, even insects are conscious. Rocks and spoons? Not so much. But insects, neurons and paramecia? Absolutely. Recent research has established associative learning even in cells and neurons (eg, Eric Kandel's work on Aplysia).
    Appreciating Robert's bulldog tenacity. I thought he was "just" a philosopher. Just goes to show, science without philosophy can only ever be scientism.

38. Roberts definitely no ones fool,thats for sure…he's very easy to listen to😊

39. A segment from 'Saved by the Light of the Buddha Within'…
    
    My new understandings of what many call 'God -The Holy Spirit' – resulting from some of the extraordinary ongoing after-effects relating to my NDE…

    Myoho-Renge-Kyo represents the identity of what some scientists are now referring to as the unified field of consciousnesses. In other words, it’s the essence of all existence and non-existence – the ultimate creative force behind planets, stars, nebulae, people, animals, trees, fish, birds, and all phenomena, manifest or latent. All matter and intelligence are simply waves or ripples manifesting to and from this core source. Consciousness (enlightenment) is itself the actual creator of everything that exists now, ever existed in the past, or will exist in the future – right down to the minutest particles of dust – each being an individual ripple or wave.
    
    The big difference between chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and most other conventional prayers is that instead of depending on a ‘middleman’ to connect us to our state of inner enlightenment, we’re able to do it ourselves. That’s because chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo allows us to tap directly into our enlightened state by way of this self-produced sound vibration. ‘Who or What Is God?’ If we compare the concept of God being a separate entity that is forever watching down on us, to the teachings of Nichiren, it makes more sense to me that the true omnipotence, omniscience and omnipresence of what most people perceive to be God, is the fantastic state of enlightenment that exists within each of us. Some say that God is an entity that’s beyond physical matter – I think that the vast amount of information continuously being conveyed via electromagnetic waves in today’s world gives us proof of how an invisible state of God could indeed exist.
    
    For example, it’s now widely known that specific data relayed by way of electromagnetic waves has the potential to help bring about extraordinary and powerful effects – including an instant global awareness of something or a mass emotional reaction. It’s also common knowledge that these invisible waves can easily be used to detonate a bomb or to enable NASA to control the movements of a robot as far away as the Moon or Mars – none of which is possible without a receiver to decode the information that’s being transmitted. Without the receiver, the data would remain impotent. In a very similar way, we need to have our own ‘receiver’ switched on so that we can activate a clear and precise understanding of our own life, all other life and what everything else in existence is.
    
    Chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo each day helps us to achieve this because it allows us to reach the core of our enlightenment and keep it switched on. That’s because Myoho-Renge-Kyo represents the identity of what scientists now refer to as the unified field of consciousnesses. To break it down – Myoho represents the Law of manifestation and latency (Nature) and consists of two alternating states. For example, the state of Myo is where everything in life that’s not obvious to us exists – including our stored memories when we’re not thinking about them – our hidden potential and inner emotions whenever they’re dormant – our desires, our fears, our wisdom, happiness, karma – and more importantly, our enlightenment.
    
    The other state, ho, is where everything in Life exists whenever it becomes evident to us, such as when a thought pops up from within our memory – whenever we experience or express our emotions – or whenever a good or bad cause manifests as an effect from our karma. When anything becomes apparent, it merely means that it’s come out of the state of Myo (dormancy/latency) and into a state of ho (manifestation). It’s the difference between consciousness and unconsciousness, being awake or asleep, or knowing and not knowing.
    
    The second law – Renge – Ren meaning cause and ge meaning effect, governs and controls the functions of Myoho – these two laws of Myoho and Renge, not only function together simultaneously but also underlies all spiritual and physical existence.
    
    The final and third part of the tri-combination – Kyo, is the Law that allows Myoho to integrate with Renge – or vice versa. It’s the great, invisible thread of energy that fuses and connects all Life and matter – as well as the past, present and future. It’s also sometimes termed the Universal Law of Communication – perhaps it could even be compared with the string theory that many scientists now suspect exists.
    
    Just as the cells in our body, our thoughts, feelings and everything else is continually fluctuating within us – all that exists in the world around us and beyond is also in a constant state of flux – constantly controlled by these three fundamental laws. In fact, more things are going back and forth between the two states of Myo and ho in a single moment than it would ever be possible to calculate or describe. And it doesn’t matter how big or small, famous or trivial anything or anyone may appear to be, everything that’s ever existed in the past, exists now or will exist in the future, exists only because of the workings of the Laws ‘Myoho-Renge-Kyo’ – the basis of the four fundamental forces, and if they didn’t function, neither we nor anything else could go on existing. That’s because all forms of existence, including the seasons, day, night, birth, death and so on, are moving forward in an ongoing flow of continuation – rhythmically reverting back and forth between the two fundamental states of Myo and ho in absolute accordance with Renge – and by way of Kyo. Even stars are dying and being reborn under the workings of what the combination ‘Myoho-Renge-Kyo’ represents. Nam, or Namu – which mean the same thing, are vibrational passwords or keys that allow us to reach deep into our life and fuse with or become one with ‘Myoho-Renge-Kyo’.
    
    On a more personal level, nothing ever happens by chance or coincidence, it’s the causes that we’ve made in our past, or are presently making, that determine how these laws function uniquely in each of our lives – as well as the environment from moment to moment. By facing east, in harmony with the direction that the Earth is spinning, and chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo for a minimum of, let’s say, ten minutes daily to start with, any of us can experience actual proof of its positive effects in our lives – even if it only makes us feel good on the inside, there will be a definite positive effect. That’s because we’re able to pierce through the thickest layers of our karma and activate our inherent Buddha Nature (our enlightened state). By so doing, we’re then able to bring forth the wisdom and good fortune that we need to challenge, overcome and change our adverse circumstances – turn them into positive ones – or manifest and gain even greater fulfilment in our daily lives from our accumulated good karma. This also allows us to bring forth the wisdom that can free us from the ignorance and stupidity that’s preventing us from accepting and being proud of the person that we indeed are – regardless of our race, colour, gender or sexuality. We’re also able to see and understand our circumstances and the environment far more clearly, as well as attract and connect with any needed external beneficial forces and situations. As I’ve already mentioned, everything is subject to the law of Cause and Effect – the ‘actual-proof-strength’ resulting from chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo always depends on our determination, sincerity and dedication.
    
    For example, the levels of difference could be compared to making a sound on a piano, creating a melody, producing a great song, and so on. Something else that’s very important to always respect and acknowledge is that the Law (or if you prefer God) is in everyone and everything.

    NB: There are frightening and disturbing sounds, and there are tranquil and relaxing sounds. It’s the emotional result of any noise or sound that can trigger off a mood or even instantly change one. When chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo each day, we are producing a sound vibration that’s the password to our true inner-self – this soon becomes apparent when you start reassessing your views on various things – such as your fears and desires etc. The best way to get the desired result when chanting is not to view things conventionally – rather than reaching out to an external source, we need to reach into our own lives and bring our needs and desires to fruition from within – including the good fortune and strength to achieve any help that we may need. Chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo also reaches out externally and draws us towards, or draws towards us, what we need to make us happy from our environment. For example, it helps us to be in the right place at the right time – to make better choices and decisions and so forth. We need to think of it as a seed within us that we’re watering and bringing sunshine to for it to grow, blossom and bring forth fruit or flowers. It’s also important to understand that everything we need in life, including the answer to every question and the potential to achieve every dream, already exists within us.

40. The idea that when you make the representations of the world flow and whiz through your head in the form of neuronal signals, you somehow get a sentient personality, is easily the stupidest idea ever entertained by mankind. A lot of time could actually have been saved by totally discarding this silly notion. It's extremely illogical and outright fatuous and is absolutely unscientific. It in fact revolts against the very intellectual sense of man. If you have become educated to harbour such notions then it would have been better if you had not gone to school at all!😡
    I am sorry for the intemperate nature of the words I have used. But if there is any view that makes me really angry and frustrated, it is this. I mean how low can our intellects go.
    [Edit: my comments are not directed against any individual. They're against the materialist ideology in general. ]

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